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Rosh Kollel: Rabbi Mordecai Kornfeld


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Bava Basra 24

BAVA BASRA 20-25 - sponsored by Harav Ari Bergmann of Lawrence, N.Y., out of love for the Torah and for those who study it.

1) FOLLOWING THE MAJORITY

(a) Support (for R. Chanina - Abaye - Mishnah): Blood found in the Prozdor (outer chamber of the womb), we are in doubt where it came from, we assume it came from the Makor (inner chamber), and she is Tamei;
1. Even though the Aliyah (upper chamber) is closer, we attribute it to the Prozdor because more blood comes from there.
(b) Rejection (Rava): There, blood from the majority source is more common, surely we follow the majority in such a case (no one would argue with R. Chanina about this)!
1. (R. Chiya): If blood was found in a woman's Prozdor, she is considered definitely Teme'ah: she is liable if she entered the Mikdash, we burn Terumah that she touches.
(c) (Rava): We learn three things from R. Chiya's law.
1. When in doubt about where something came from, we assume it came from the majority, even if the minority is closer;
2. Mid'Oraisa, we follow the majority;
3. R. Zeira's law is correct.
i. (R. Zeira): We follow even a single majority (i.e. if the city doors are locked, so only one majority applies, i.e. of the city, we do not reckon with the majority of passersby).
ii. Also in a woman, there is only one majority, there is no other place the blood could be from!
(d) Version #1A - Rashi - Question: Above, Rava said that when the majority source is more common, all agree that we follow the majority, but here he says that R. Chiya is a support for R. Chanina!
(e) Version #1B - Maharam (in Tosfos) - Question: Above, Rava said that blood from the Aliyah (the majority source) is more common (for if not, R. Chanina would not have taught his law, it follows from R. Chiya's law), but here he says that R. Chiya is a support for R. Chanina!
(f) Answer: Rava retracted, R. Chiya does not support R. Chanina.
(g) Version #2 (R. Gershom) Question: Above, Rava said that we follow the majority source only if it is more common - here, he says we follow any majority!
(h) Answer: Rava retracted from what he said above. (End of Version #2)
(i) (Rav): A barrel (of wine) floating in a river: if it was found near a city that is mostly Yisraelim, it is permitted; if the nearest city is mostly Nochrim, it is forbidden;
(j) (Shmuel): Even if it was found near a city that is mostly Yisraelim, it is forbidden - perhaps it came from Ihi Dekira (a Nochri city upstream).
(k) Suggestion: They argue about R. Chanina's law: Shmuel follows the majority like R. Chanina, Rav argues and assumes it came from the closest.
(l) Rejection No, all agree with R. Chanina;
1. Rav says that it could not have come from Ihi Dekira, for it would have broken on rocks in the river;
2. Shmuel says that it may have floated in the middle of the river, where there are no rocks.
(m) A barrel of wine (was presumably stolen and) was found in an orchard of Orlah; Ravina permitted it (we assume it came from elsewhere - most fruit in the world is not Orlah).
(n) Suggestion: Ravina holds like R. Chanina.
(o) Rejection: No - he only permitted in this case because a thief would not hide wine in the place he stole the grapes (lest they see him stomp them).
1. This only refers to wine, but he would hide the grapes there.
(p) Jugs of wine were found hidden among vines in Reuven's vineyard; Rava permitted them.
(q) Suggestion: Rava argues with R. Chanina (he goes after the closest possible source, not the majority).
(r) Rejection: No, this case is different, most of the vendors (in the entire region) selling jugs of wine are Yisrael.
24b---------------------------------------24b

1. This only applies to large jugs, but small jugs are forbidden, perhaps they fell from travelers (who may have come from far away, the majority are Nochrim).
2. If large and small jugs are found together, all are permitted;
i. Travelers do not carry large jugs, but merchants often use small jugs to balance a load on the donkey.
2) A TREE NEAR A CITY
(a) (Mishnah): We distance a tree 25 Amos from a city; a carob or sycamore tree must be distanced 50 Amos;
(b) Aba Sha'ul says, any barren tree must be distanced 50 Amos;
1. If the city was there first, we (people of the city) may cut it, we need not pay the owner;
2. If the tree was there first, we may cut it, we must pay.
3. If we are unsure which came first, we may cut it, we need not pay.
(c) (Gemara) Question: Why must trees be distanced?
(d) Answer (Ula): For the beauty of the city.
(e) Question: Even more should be forbidden, we may not convert a Migrash (1000 Amos surrounding a city in each direction) into a field or vice-versa!
(f) Answer #1: The Mishnah is R. Eliezer, who says that we may convert a Migrash into a field or vice-versa;
1. Twenty-five Amos are forbidden on account of beauty of the city.
(g) Answer #2: Even Chachamim, who say that we may not convert a Migrash into a field or vice-versa, only forbid a seeded field, but we may plant trees;
1. Twenty-five Amos are forbidden on account of beauty of the city.
(h) Question: What is the source to distinguish between a seeded field and trees?
(i) Answer (Beraisa): A Karfaf (an unroofed enclosed area) more than the area in which one can grow two Se'ah that was enclosed for dwelling: if the majority was seeded, it is like a garden, it is forbidden to carry in it on Shabbos;
1. If the majority was planted (with trees), it is like a Chatzer, it is permitted to carry in it.
(j) (Mishnah): If the city was there first, we (people of the city) may cut it, we need not pay the owner.
(k) Question: If a tree is near a pit, the owner of the pit may cut it and pay the owner (25B); if a tree near a city, we (the city residents) may cut it and do not pay the owner;
1. Why are the laws different?
(l) Answer (Rav Kahana): An individual will pay (for the tree) for the sake of his pit;
1. There are many people in the city, no one wants to pay first. (If we cannot cut it without paying, it will not be cut.)
(m) Objection: Why was the question asked? Damage to the public is worse than damage to an individual!
(n) Correction: Rather, Rav Kahana replied to a question on the end of the Mishnah.
(o) (Mishnah): If the tree was there first, we may cut it, we must pay.
(p) Question: Why can't the owner demand to be paid before they cut the tree?
(q) Answer (Rav Kahana): It will be a long time before the money is collected. (After we cut, the owner can go to Beis Din to demand compensation.)
(r) (Mishnah): If we are unsure which came first, we may cut it, we need not pay.
(s) Question: What is the difference between the case of a pit (he may not cut when in doubt) and our case (when in doubt, we cut)?
(t) Answer: If the tree preceded the pit, it should not be cut - when in doubt, we do not cut;
1. Here, either way the tree should be cut, we may cut it;
2. We are in doubt if we must pay for it - to collect money, the owner must bring proof.
3) DISTANCING A GRANARY
(a) (Mishnah): We distance a fixed granary 50 Amos from a city;
(b) One may not make a fixed granary on his property unless he owns 50 Amos around it in each direction.
1. He must distance it from his neighbor's saplings and Nir (plowed, unseeded field) so it will not damage them.
(c) (Gemara) Question: Why is the law different in the last case (50 Amos are not required)?
(d) Answer #1 (Abaye): The last clause speaks of a granary that is not fixed.
1. Question: What is the case of a granary that is not fixed?
2. Answer (R. Yosi b'Rebbi Chanina): There is so little grain that the wind winnows it itself, one need not throw it with a pitchfork.
(e) Answer #2 (Rav Ashi): Fifty Amos are required; the last clause explains the first clause:
1. We distance a fixed granary 50 Amos from a city in order that it will not damage.
(f) Question (against Abaye - Beraisa): We distance a fixed granary 50 Amos from a city;
1. We keep the same distance from gourds, saplings and a Nir.
2. This is left difficult.
(g) We understand how the granary hurts gourds - the dust enters the buds and dries them.
(h) Question: How does it harm a Nir?
(i) Answer (R. Aba bar Zavda): It overfertilizes it (this burns the seeds).
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