POINT BY POINT SUMMARY
Prepared by Rabbi P. Feldman
of Kollel Iyun Hadaf, Yerushalayim
Rosh Kollel: Rabbi Mordecai Kornfeld
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Previous daf Bava Kama 65
1) "RESUSCITATING" THE PRINCIPLE
(a) (Rav): A thief pays principle as the value at the time he
stole it; the additional payments (of double payment, or
4 or 5) are as the value at the time of the trial.
(b) Question: Why is this?
2) THE ADDED FIFTH
1. Answer: It says "Theft" and "Living" - the thief
must resuscitate what he stole as when he stole it.
(c) Question (Rav Sheshes - Beraisa): A thief stole an animal
and fattened it - he pays double, 4 or 5 as at the time
(d) Answer: Since the thief fattened the animal, it is not
reasonable that he should pay extra for this.
(e) Question (Beraisa): A thief stole a fat animal and
weakened it - he pays double, 4 or 5 as at the time he
(f) Answer: Weakening the animal is as partially killing it
(it is not reasonable that he should pay less for this).
(g) Rav's law applies when the price of animals changed.
(h) Question: What is the case?
1. Suggestion: It was worth 1 (Zuz) when he stole it,
and 4 later (at the time of the trial); Rav argues
(i) Answer: (Rav does not argue,) the case is it was worth 4
when he stole it, and 1 later.
i. (Rabah): Reuven stole a barrel of wine worth 1
Zuz; later, the price went up to 4, and he
broke it or drank it - he pays 4; if it broke
by itself, he pays 1.
1. He pays 4 as principle, and 1 for payments of
double, 4 and 5.
(a) Support ((for Rav) R. Chanina - Beraisa): A watchman
claimed that the deposit was stolen; he swore falsely,
admitted that he lied, and witnesses testified that the
watchman himself took it:
1. If he admitted before witnesses came, he pays
principle, an added fifth (quarter of the
principle), and brings an Asham;
2. R. Yakov says, if he admitted after witnesses came,
he pays double and brings an Asham; the extra
payment (of the double payment) counts as the added
3) AN ANIMAL THAT CHANGED
3. Chachamim say, "In its principle and its fifth" -
one only adds a fifth when paying principle (not
when paying double).
(b) Question: R. Yakov said that the extra payment counts as
the fifth - what is the case?
4. R. Shimon bar Yochai says, the fifth and Asham only
apply when a double payment is made.
1. Suggestion: If the deposit was worth 4 from
beginning to end - the extra payment is 4, the added
fifth is only 1!
(c) Answer: Rather, it was worth 4 when he stole it, and 1 at
the end - the extra payment is 1, and so is the added
(d) This shows that the principle is paid as the initial
price (since the fifth is a quarter of the principle),
and extra payments are as the final price!
(e) Rejection (Rava): Really, it was worth 4 from beginning
to end; the case is, he swore 4 times, so the extra
payment (4) equals the added fifths!
1. "Its fifths" - the Torah said that many fifths can
be paid on 1 principle.
(f) (Beraisa - Chachamim) "In its principle and its fifth" -
one only adds a fifth when paying (only) principle (but
he brings an Asham).
(g) Question: The same reason he is exempt from the fifth
should also exempt from the Asham - "In its principle and
its fifth v'Es (and) his Asham"!
(h) Answer: Chachamim hold, the word "Es" separates (that
Asham is not dependent on only paying principle);
1. R. Shimon holds, the word "Es" connects (that also
Asham is dependent on only paying principle).
2. Chachamim: If so, the Torah should have omitted the
3. R. Shimon: It must be written to separate between
money paid to a person (the fifth) and what goes to
(a) (R. Ila'i): A man stole a lamb or calf, it grew up and
became a ram or ox - this is a change, he acquires it;
1. If he slaughters or sells it, he slaughters or sells
his own animal.
(b) Question (R. Chanina - Beraisa): A man stole a lamb, it
grew up and became a ram or ox - he pays double, 4 or 5
as at the time of the theft.
1. If he acquires it through the change - he should not
pay 4 or 5, he slaughters or sells his own animal!
(c) Question (R. Zeira): He should acquire because the stolen
item has a new name!
2. Counter-question: (R. Ilai): If he does not acquire
- why does he pay as the time of the theft - he
should pay as now!
3. Answer (R. Chanina): He does not pay as now, because
he stole a lamb, not a ram!
(d) Answer (Rava): A 1-day old ox is also called an ox.
1. We learn from "An ox...that will be born".
(e) Question (b) has still not been answered!
2. Similarly by rams - "The rams of your flock I did
not eat" - surely, Yakov also did not eat Lavan's
(f) Answer (Rav Sheshes): The Beraisa is as Beis Shamai, who
say that one does not acquire through a change.
1. (Beraisa #1): A man paid a harlot with wheat, olives
or grapes, and she made them into flour, oil or wine
- they may not be offered on the Altar (they are
still considered her wages);
2. (Beraisa #2): They may be offered.
3. (Rav Yosef - Beraisa): Beis Shamai forbid, Beis
4. Question: Why do Beis Shamai forbid?
5. Answer: The verse (forbidding a harlot's wages and
something traded for a dog as sacrifices) says
"Also", to include what they are transformed into.
i. Beis Hillel explain, they are forbidden - not
what they are transformed into.
6. Question: What do Beis Hillel learn from "Also"?
ii. Beis Shamai explain, they are forbidden - not
iii. Beis Hillel say, both are excluded.
i. This is left unanswered.