Ask A Question about the Daf

Previous daf (Daf 5)
(We apologize for missing the Insights mailing for Nidah 6-10. One of our Kollel members contracted mono-nucleosis and missed a week, and this time we weren't able to make it up in time!)

Nidah 11

11b

1. SETTING A FIXED "VESES" DURING A WOMAN'S "YEMEI TOHAR"
   • Question: The Mishnah teaches that a woman need not check for bleeding during Yemei Tohar (i.e., days 15-80 after the birth of a female child and days 8-40 after the birth of a male child). As the Gemara explains, the reason for this is that even if a woman bleeds during Yemei Tohar in a manner that would normally establish a fixed Veses, no such Veses is established.

     RASHI (DH Dilma) explains under what circumstances the Gemara means to say that a Veses is not established during Yemei Tohar: A woman gave birth to a female child. She saw blood during her Yemei Tohar three times, each twenty days after the previous time (i.e., day 15, day 35, day 55 -- according to Raban Gamliel who requires three equally spaced shows of blood to determine a Veses). Since the bleeding occurred during Yemei Tohar, no Veses is established.

     1. Why did Rashi have to squeeze all three shows of blood into the 80-day period of Yemei Tohar? He should have simply explained that the woman saw one of the shows of blood during Yemei Tohar, followed by two more shows of blood after the Yemei Tohar have concluded, at a comfortable time span of 30 days apart (as Rashi 11a DH v'Ein Isha explains with regard to establishing a Veses during Yemei Nidah)! (ARUCH LA'NER; MEI NIDAH)

        (It is obvious that even in such a manner a Veses may not be established, for otherwise a woman ought to check herself during Yemei Tohar in order to establish such a Veses -- M. Kornfeld)

     2. Rashi makes it clear that according to Raban Shimon ben Gamliel, it is impossible to establish a 30-day Veses through 3 shows of blood during Yemei Tohar. The period of Yemei Tohar is just too short. At best, a woman could have established a 20-day Veses, had it been possible to establish a Veses during Yemei Tohar.

        Why is that so? A 3-show Veses of 30 days could easily be established by a woman who has a show of blood once at the beginning of Yemei Tohar, once at the end of Yemei Tohar, and once in middle of the Yemei Tohar (e.g. days 15, 45 and 75)!

        The answer that immediately comes to mind is that Rashi is discussing a "Veses Haflagah," i.e. a Veses that is dependent on a time-span between shows of blood rather than shows of blood on a constant day of the month. Such a Veses is established only after 3 equal time-spans have passed between shows of blood, i.e. after a total of 4 shows of blood. According to Raban Shimon ben Gamliel, the woman must have 3 shows of blood besides the original bleeding in order to establish a Veses, e.g. on days 15, 35, 55, and 75. It is impossible to squeeze 4 shows of blood which are each 30 days apart, into the 66 Yemei Tohar.

        However, the question still remains: why did Rashi choose to discuss Veses Haflagah in the first place? The Gemara could be easily explained in terms a 30-day Veses ha'Chodesh (which requires a total of 3, and not 4, shows of blood) -- e.g. if a woman had a show of blood on days 15, 45, and 75, which all happened to be on the same day of the month! (ARUCH LA'NER)

   • Answer: (I'm afraid we could not come up with a viable answer for these questions. We await your suggestions!)

     (Permission is granted to print and redistribute this material as long as this header and the footer at the end of the mailing are included.) Join our free E-mail lists! Instructions at end of this mailing.