Ask A Question on the daf

Previous daf

1) A BONE WITHOUT A KAZAYIS OF MEAT [continued]

(a) Answer: The Bereisa is prohibiting breaking a bone with a Kazayis of meat either upon it or within it (marrow).
(b) A Bereisa is brought to support this explanation (and to reject the application of Aseh Docheh Lo Sa'aseh to breaking the bone).
(c) Question: Why should we need the procedure of scraping in the coming Mishna, it should suffice to scrape off enough to allow us to break the bone?
(d) Answer #1 [Abaye]: We are concerned for damaging other parts.
(e) Answer #2 [Ravina]: Because of [the marrow within the] Kulis.

(a) Pigul and Nosar cause Tumas Yadayim.

1. Rav Huna said it is on account of suspicion (referring to Pigul)
2. Rav Chisda said it is on account of laziness (referring to Nosar).
3. One learns the amount as Kazayis, drawing from Issur.
4. One learns the amount as Kebeitzah, drawing from Tumah.

(b) Question: Is there a similar Tumah applied to a Korban Yotzei?

1. Do we apply the concerns of Nosar to Yotzei?
2. Perhaps those concerns do not apply to the active Yotzei?

(c) Answer: The Mishna implies that it does not apply to Yotzei.

1. We learned that the meat may be scraped off a Yotzei.
2. If the Tumah applied, we could not eat the adjoining meat!

(d) Rejection: The connection is hidden Tumah.
(e) Question: According to Ravina, the parts of the meat are considered separate and are then touching, causing visible contact?!
(f) Answer: Rather, the one who learns Kazayis speaks where the amount which was Yotzei is less than that, and the one who learns the amount as Kebeitzah learns that the amount was less than that.
(g) Question: We see from the Bereisa that the Gezeirah does *not* apply to Yotzei.

1. It is prohibited to remove a Korban Pesach from one group to another.
2. This results in the Korban being Tahor, presumably, even though it is invalidated by being Yotzei!

(h) Answer: No, it is Tahor and permitted.
(i) Question: But we later learn that one who does so violates a Lav?

1. The one who learns the amount as a Kebeitzah can say that the Gezeirah only applies to that amount, but the prohibition applies even to a Kazayis.
2. What, however, will the one who learns Kazayis do?

(j) Answer: The original question was regarding Yotzei by all other Kodeshim.

1. The Gezeirah does not apply to members of the Pesach group, who are careful.
2. The new question remains unanswered.

3) THE SOURCE FOR YOTZEI BY KORBAN PESACH

(a) Question: What is the source for the Issur of Yotzei from one Chaburah to another?
(b) Answer: "Lo Sotzi"

1. Question: That is stated as being from the house; what about from one Chaburah to another?
2. Answer: "Chutzah"

(c) [R. Ami] One who takes out the Korban Pesach from one group to another violates the Lav only once he sets it down, similar to the Meleches Hotza'ah of Shabbos.
(d) Question: But we find the term "Yotzei" applying even to cases where the item is *not* set down (e.g. the Parim HaNisrafim)!?
(e) Answer: The items were upon the ground, and considered at rest.

(a) If a bone of a Korban Pesach which went partially out, one must scrape away the Pasul meat, then scrape away the Kosher meat to the joint and cut off the bone.
(b) Of other Kodeshim, the bone is cut.
(c) The inner edge of the gate is considered within; from that point outward is considered out.
(d) The windows and the thickness of the wall is considered within.

(a) [R. Yehudah] The same parameters of "in" and "out" apply to Tefilah.
(b) [R. Yehoshua b. Levi] There are no blocks when dealing with communicating with HaShem.

(a) Question: The Mishna seems to contradict itself regarding the status of the Agaf itself?
(b) Answer: One is speaking of the gates of the Azarah; one of the gates of Jerusalem.

1. The gates of Jerusalem were not sanctified to give the Metzorayim a shelter from the weather.
2. The gates of the Azarah were all sanctified, except Nikanor.

(c) Question: Why was the Nikanor gate not sanctified?
(d) Answer: To allow the Metzorayim to do their Avodah from there.