POINT BY POINT SUMMARY
by Rabbi Ephraim Becker
Kollel Iyun Hadaf, Yerushalayim
Rosh Kollel: Rabbi Mordecai Kornfeld
Ask A Question on the daf
Previous dafPesachim 89
Pesachim 81 - 95: We are grateful to Mr. Mark Frankel of Queens, N.Y. for
suggesting the idea of "Point by Point Summaries" and sponsoring its initial
two weeks -- Tizkeh l'Mitzvos!
1) POTENTIAL SOLUTIONS TO THE MIXUP PROBLEM
(a) Question: Let each group include a Kohen?
2) MISHNA: MORE CONDITIONAL APPOINTMENTS
(b) Answer: This, too, is not possible.
1. If the Kohen has already performed the Pesach, he may not be
appointed to the Pesach Sheni.
(c) Question: Appoint one Kohen to all five Chaburos, and have him
eat the Chazeh and Shok of each Korban.
2. If the Kohen has not yet done the Pesach, then perhaps he
will not fulfil his obligation if this is a Shelamim.
(d) Answer: This would limit the eating of the Shelamim (the time
limit of Pesach is shorter than the limit of a Shelamim).
(e) Question: Let each group make a Mosar HaPesach.
(f) Answer: There is no such designation as a Mosar HaPesach.
(g) Question: Let them bring actual Mosar HaPesach from others!
(h) Answer: The Mosar would require Semichah, not the Korban.
(i) Question: But a woman's Mosar would *not* require Semichah?!
(j) Answer: We would not know what to do with the Matanos.
1. Question: But b'di'Eved it would be alright?!
2. Answer: The Zerikah (as opposed to Shefichah) would not be.
3. Question: But Shefichah would work b'di'Eved?!
4. Answer: We would not do so l'Chatchilah.
(a) If a father made a condition that the first son to arrive will be
appointed to the Korban, then the first to enter with his head
and majority of his body is the one.
(b) The appointed son brings his brother along with him.
(a) Question: This Mishna implies Bereirah!?
4) LIMITS TO APPOINTMENT
(b) Answer: The father only wishes to spur his sons on (as implied by
the fact that the one son brings his brother along).
1. Question: The above can be demonstrated since if he was
truly "bringing his brother along," the father cannot
appoint them after Shechitah?!
2. Answer: It must be that the appointment came before (and the
Bereisa lends support to this understanding of the Mishna).
(a) We can add people to the Chaburah until only a KeZayis remains
for each person.
5) WITHDRAWING - "MESHICHAH"
(b) The appointments continue until Shechitah.
(c) R. Shimon says until Zerikah.
(a) Question: What is the news of the Mishna?
(b) Answer: That one group can withdraw and another can replace it.
(c) [Abaye] The Machlokes only applies to withdrawal;
1. Rabanan understand the Pasuk to mean as long as it lives.
(d) Appointment, however, can take place only until Shechitah.
2. R. Shimon understands it to mean its Avodah.
1. The pasuk puts the Shechitah after the appointments.
2. The Bereisa supports both statements of Abaye.
6) A MEMBER BRINGING ANOTHER APPOINTEE
(a) If one member adds others, the original members may give him his
portion and send him off to eat it with his invitees.
7) A QUICK-HANDED EATER AMONG THE GROUP
(a) Question: How must the group treat a member who eats faster (and
more) than others?
8) THE MONEY FOR APPOINTMENT
1. Can he claim his right to eat as well as anyone, or;
(b) Answer: The Mishna, by allowing the group to limit and send away
the one who has "expanded" his portion, indicates the same here.
2. Can they claim that his privilege regards the Korban, not
(c) Rejection: The Mishna is a matter of personalities (the group not
wishing others to participate, even if they eat very little).
(d) Answer: The Mishna regarding the Shamash seems to support the
members of the Chaburah (their following him is *optional*).
(e) Rejection: Their relationship with the Shamash is unlike another
member (they did not hire him to put themselves out for *him*).
(f) Answer: The Bereisa gives the group permission to separate the
portion of the quick-handed eater from theirs.
1. In addition even if they combine their food to eat an
ordinary meal together, they may give him his portion.
(g) R. Papa and R. Huna b. R. Yehoshua combined their meals.
2. Question: What is this "addition?"
3. Answer #1: Not only by a Pesach can they split up (claiming
that they only joined for "sharing" the Korban, not for the
meal) but they are entitled to do so by any meal.
4. Answer #2: The matter of dividing the Korban was a question.
The Bereisa thus teaches that they may only send him away on
account of his eating habits (not for other reasons).
1. R. Papa ate four times as much as R. Huna.
2. R. Huna, after presenting the above arguments and receiving
the above counter-arguments, finally proved that he was
entitled to divide his meal and separate from his Chavrusa.
3. After they separated R. Huna joined with Ravina, who, to the
chagrin of R. Huna, consumed eight times as much as him.
(a) The monies received from those who wish to participate in one's
Korban are Hulin.
(b) There is no way to sell one's Olah or Shelamim and *any* monies
received for such a sale become a Nedavah to the Beis HaMikdash.
1. Question: If there is no sale, why are the monies Nedavah?
2. Answer [Rava]: It is a penalty.
3. Question: What is meant by *any* monies?
4. Answer: Even if he paid more than the animal was worth.