ANSWERS TO REVIEW QUESTIONS
prepared by Rabbi Eliezer Chrysler
Kollel Iyun Hadaf, Jerusalem
Previous daf Zevachim 28
ZEVACHIM 26-30 - Dedicated to the leaders and participants in the Dafyomi
shiurim at the Young Israel of New Rochelle, by Andy & Nancy Neff
(a) We initially think that the skin of the fat-tail is considered part of
the fat-tail. The ramifications of this supposition as far as a lamb of
Shelamim is concerned are - that it must be brought on the Mizbe'ach
together with the fat-tail.
(b) The problem with this is - that our Mishnah considers a Machshavah to
eat the skin of the Alyah a Machsheves P'sul - whereas the Chachamim do not
consider a Machshavah from Achilas Mizbe'ach to Achilas Adam a Machsheves
(c) So Shmuel establishes our Mishnah like Rebbi Eliezer. The Tana Kama of a
Mishnah in the next Perek states that if one Shechted a Zevach with the
intention of eating something that is normally burned or vice-versa, remains
Kasher. Rebbi Eliezer disagrees - because he holds that a Machshavah from
Achilas Adam to Achilas Mizbe'ach, or vice-versa, is valid.
(a) From the Seifa of the Mishnah, 'Zeh ha'Kelal, Kol ha'Shochet,
ve'ha'Mekabel ... Le'echol Davar she'Darko Le'echol u'Lehaktir Davar
she'Darko Lehaktir' we extrapolate - 'Ha Le'echol Davar she'Ein Davar
Le'echol, Lo' (like the Rabbanan).
(b) When they asked Shmuel 'Reisha Rebbi Eliezer, Seifa Rabbanan'?, he
answered - 'In (Yes) 'Reisha Rebbi Eliezer, Seifa Rabbanan'.
(c) Rav Huna disagrees with Shmuel. He maintains - that the skin of the
fat-tail is not like the fat-tail (as far as burning it on the Mizbe'ach is
(d) And Rabah derives this from the Pasuk (in connection with the Chalavim
that go on the Mizbe'ach) "Chelbo ha'Alyah Temimah" - ''Chelbo ha'Alyah",
've'Lo Or ha'Alyah'.
(a) According to Rav Huna, the author of our Mishnah will be the Rabbanan.
(b) Rav Chisda agrees with Shmuel on principle, but he establishes our
Mishnah by the skin of the fat-tail of a kid-goat - which is not brought on
the Mizbe'ach, and which is therefore considered 'Achilas Adam (with which
we have no problem in the first place).
(c) The other two Amora'im decline to learn like ...
1. ... Shmuel - because they consider 'Reisha Rebbi Eliezer, Seifa Rabbanan'
to be a Dochek.
(d) The Mishnah in Chulin is speaking - in connection with Tum'ah, and
teaches us that, because the skin of the Alyah is soft, it is considered
Basar to combine with less than a k'Beitzah with regard to Tum'as Ochel, or
with less than a k'Zayis with regard to Tum'as Neveilah.
2. ... Rav Huna - because they maintain that the skin of the Alyah is like
3. ... Rav Chisda - because we have already learned a Mishnah in Chulin
've'Eilu she'Oroseihen ki'Besaran, Or ha'Alyah', and a mere repetition of
the same Halachah would be unnecessary.
(e) Nevertheless, if not for our Mishnah, Rav Chisda explains, we might have
thought that with regard to eating Korbanos, the skin of the Alyah is not
considered part of the Alyah, because the Torah writes ''le'Moshchah"
(regarding Korbanos), implying that one eats then in royal fashion (and
kings do not usually eat the skin of the Alyah). Presumably, "le'Moshchah"
then refers to the way one eats the Korbanos, and not to which parts of then
(a) The Tana Kama of the Beraisa rules - that if someone Shechts an Olah
with the intention of bringing a k'Zayis of skin under the Alyah ...
1. ... Chutz li'Mekomo - it is Pasul, but whoever eats it is not subject to
(b) Elazar ben Yehudah Ish Aveilim (and other Tana'im) includes the skin of
the leg from the knee downwards of a small animal and the skin of the head
of a tender kid-goat in the Tana Kama's ruling. By 'tender' he means - in
its first year.
2. ... Chutz li'Zemano - it is Pigul, and whoever eats it is Chayav Kareis.
(c) And when he adds 've'Chol she'Manu Chachamim Gabi Tum'ah 've'Eilu
she'Oroseihem ki'Besaran', he means to add - the skin of a female animal's
womb (though it cannot pertain to an Olah, which is always a male).
(d) By speaking specifically about an Olah, the Tana Kama implies - that by
Zevachim, the skin of the Alyah is not considered like the Alyah (a Kashya
on Rav Chisda) who holds that the skin of the Alyah is considered part of
the Alyah even as regards Kodshim that are eaten.
(a) Rav Huna have no problem with this - because he precludes the skin of
the Alyah (which he considers Basar) from the Pasuk "Chelbo ha'Alyah
Semimah" from becoming Emurim, but not from being one of the Nesachim (the
pieces of Olah that are all brought on the Mizbe'ach). See Tosfos DH 'Ela
(b) We give two answers to reconcile Rav Chisda with the Beraisa; one of
them that the Beraisa too, is speaking about the Alyah of a kid-goat - which
does not go on the Mizbe'ach anyway, and must therefore be referring to a
Machsheves Achilah (even if the Beraisa is talking about an Olah).
(c) The second answer is - to actually amend the Beraisa from 'ha'Shochet es
ha'Olah' to 'ha'Shochet es ha'Zevach'.
(a) We interpret the Pasuk ...
1. ... "ve'Im He'achol Ye'achel mi'Besar Zevach Shelamav ba'Yom
ha'Shelishi" - with regard to a Machsheves Chutz li'Zemano (Pigul), where
someone performed one of the main Avodos of a Shelamim with the intention of
eating it on the third day.
(b) We counter the suggestion that "Mimenu" rather includes Chutz li'Zemano,
because it is mentioned first - by proposing that perhaps it comes to
include Chutz li'Mekomo, because it directly precedes the Chiyuv Kareis.
2. ... "Pigul Yih'yeh" - with regard to a Machsheves Chutz li'Mekomo.
3. ... "Ve'nichresah ha'Nefesh ha'Ocheles *Mimenu* Avonah Tisa" - that one
is only Chayav Kareis for eating one of them, but not both.
(c) So Abaye cites a Beraisa that he heard from Rav Yitzchak bar Avdimi Amar
Rav. The Tana interprets the Pasuk in Kedoshim "ve'Im He'achol Ye'achel
be'Yom ha'Shelishi Pigul Hu Lo Yeratzeh" to mean Chutz li'Mekomo - because
we already know Chutz li'Zemano from the Pasuk in Tzav.
(d) He knows that the Pasuk is talking about a P'sul Machshavah, and not
about someone who eats a Shelamim on the third day - because the Torah
writes "Lo Yeratzeh", and it is not possible for a Korban that is already
Kasher to become Pasul simply because the Basar was eaten after its time.
(a) And the prohibition of Nosar (a Korban or part of a Korban [in this
case, a Shelamim] that was left over after its allotted time of eating
expired [from the third day and onwards]) we will learn from the principle
'Ein Mikra Yotze mi'Yedei Peshuto' (since the Torah refers specifically to
someone who eats it on the third day', he too, is included in the
(b) "ve'Ochlav Avono Yisa" means - that whoever eats it is Chayav Kareis ...
(c) ... and it refers to - Nosar.
(d) "ve'Ochlav" In the singular) comes to preclude - she'Lo bi'Mekomo from
(a) Perhaps, we suggest, "ve'Ochlav" refers to Chutz li'Mekomo, and
precludes Nosar - because it is written directly after it (since the main
Pasuk refers to Chutz li'Mekomo, as we explained).
(b) We answer that it is more likely to include Nosar than Chutz li'Mekomo,
in order to learn Chutz li'Zemano from it with the 'Gezeirah-Shavah' "Avon"
"Avon" - meaning that the Pasuk in Tzav mentions "ve'Ochlav Avono Yisa" but
not Kareis, and the 'Gezeirah-Shavah' from Nosar (which mentions both)
teaches us that 'Nesi'as Avon' means Kareis.
(c) The advantage of Nosar over Chutz li'Mekomo (see Tosfos DH 'Mistavra')
is hinted in Z.V. - which refer to 'Z'man' (as opposed to Chutz li'Mekomo)
and Bamah (where both Nosar and Chutz li'Zemano apply, but not Chutz
(d) We counter this however, by pointing out that Chutz li'Mekomo has four
advantages over Nosar, as hinted in M.K.D.Sh., which stand for 'Machshavah;,
'K'tzas', 'Dam' and 'Shelishi' - they are both P'sul Machshavah, both forbid
the entire Korban with even a P'sul Machshavah on only part of the Korban,
both are not applicable after the Zerikas Dam, and by both "Shelishi" is
superfluous for a 'Gezeirah-Shavah', all of which do not apply to Nosar.
(a) Rebbi Yochanan therefore cites a Beraisa quoted by Zavdi ben Levi who
applies the Kareis to Nosar, based on the 'Gezeirah-Shavah' "ki es *Kodesh*
Hashem Chilel" from "Ve'sarafta es ha'Nosar ba'Eish ... ki *Kodesh* Hu"
(Tetzaveh). "ki es *Kodesh* Hashem Chilel" is - the continuation of
"ve'Ochlav Avono Yisa".
(b) And we now learn from "ki Kodesh Hu" - that "ve'Ochlav Avono Yisa"
pertains to Nosar and not to Machsheves Chutz li'Mekomo.
(c) We then suggest that perhaps the long Pasuk (in Tzav) refers to Chutz
li'Mekomo, and the Pasuk in Kedoshim, to Chutz li'Zemano, which means
practically - that Chutz li'Mekomo will be subject to Kareis, whereas Chutz
li'Zemano will not.
(d) Again, we apply the S'vara that, since we learn Kareis by the Pasuk in
Tzav from the 'Gezeirah-Shavah' "Avon" "Avon" from Nosar, it is more likely
to pertain to Chutz li'Zemano, due to the similarities hinted in Z.V. We
counter this proof however - with 'Adraba', on the contrary, if anything, it
would be more logical to place Nosar and Chutz li'Zemano together in the
same Pasuk, due to their similarity, and to include one in Kareis and
preclude the other, (and let the Pasuk in Tzav talk about Chutz li'Mekomo).
(a) Rava finally reverts to Rabah's initial D'rashah, learning both Chutz
li'Zemano and Chutz li'Mekomo from "ve'Im He'achol Ye'achel" in Tzav. He
learns from ...
1. ... the double Lashon "He'achol Ye'achel" - that Pigul applies both to a
Machsheves Achilas Adam and a Machsheves Achilas Mizbe'ach.
(b) When he says 'Mefaglin u'Mispaglin' - he means that it is restricted to
those Korbanos which have something which creates Pigul (such as the blood),
and something which becomes Pigul, such as the Basar or the Eimurin.
2. ... "mi'B'sar Zevach Shelamav" - that it applies to other Korbanos,
(c) To preclude from the Din of Pigul - the Minchas Kohanim, the Minchas
Kohen Gadol and the Minchas Nesachim, which are entirely burned and are not
(d) And he learns from ...
1. ... "Shelishi" - that the Pasuk is referring to a Machsheves Chutz
2. ... "Lo Yeratzeh" (bearing in mind that this automatically implies the
Zerikas Dam) - that Pigul will only take affect if the blood is ultimately
sprinkled on the Mizbe'ach ('ad she'Yakrivu Kol Matirav [but if, for
example, it spills before the Zerikah, the Pigul is negated]).
3. ... "ha'Makriv" - that Pigul takes place at the time of Hakravah (in the
form of a P'sul Machshavah during one of the Avodos, and is not simply Nosar
on the third day).
4. ... "Oso" - that it is the Korban which becomes Pasul and not the Kohen.
5. ... "Lo Yechashev" - that if the Kohen has other thoughts, such as Chutz
li'Mekomo (besides those of Chutz li'Zemano), It is Pasul but no longer
Pigul (i.e. and there is no Kareis).
(a) "Pigul" comes to include Machsheves Chutz li'Mekomo, and we learn from
"Yih'yeh" - that if the Kohen Shechted the Korban with the intention of
eating half a k'Zayis tomorrow and half a k'Zayis outside the Mechitzah, the
Korban becomes Pasul.
(b) And now that we learn from "Avono Yisa" that Pigul is subject to Kareis,
we learn from "ve'ha'Nefesh ha'Ocheles *Mimenu*" - that only one of them is
(c) And we know that the one that is included is Chutz li'Zemano, - because
we learn it from a 'Gezeirah-Shavah' "Avon" "Avon" from Nosar (as we
explained earlier), to which Machsheves Z'man is similar in Z.V. (Z'man and
Bamah) as we explained there (and not Chutz li'Mekomo, to which Nosar is not
similar at all).
(d) We could not give the same answer above, when we asked on Rabah at the
beginning of the Sugya that perhaps "Mimenu" comes to include Chutz
li'Mekomo, because it directly precedes the Chiyuv Kareis, and to preclude
Chutz li'Zemano - seeing as we had not yet learned the 'Gezeirah-Shavah'
from Nosar (to which we are now comparing she'Lobi'Zemano).