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Rosh Kollel: Rabbi Mordecai Kornfeld


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Avodah Zarah 75

AVODAH ZARAH 72-76 - Sponsored by a generous grant from an anonymous donor. Kollel Iyun Hadaf is indebted to him for his encouragement and support and prays that Hashem will repay him in kind.

1) DRYING VESSELS

(a) Question: How do we dry vessels?
(b) Answer #1 (Rav): We use water (this will be explained).
(c) Answer #2 (Rabah bar bar Chanah): We use ashes.
(d) Objection: Does Rav say that we use only water, does Rabah bar bar Chanah say that we use only ashes?!
(e) Answer: No - each mentioned one, he agrees that we also use the other;
1. They do not argue - when it is wet, we first apply ashes; when it is dry, we first apply water.
(f) (In all the following versions, we always alternate between applications of water and ashes. When it is wet, we first apply ashes; when it is dry, we first apply water. The last application is always water, but sometimes this is not counted.)
(g) Version #1 - Chachamim of Sura - (Rav): There are (a total of) two or three applications of water and ashes (depending on whether it was wet or dry, as will be explained)
(h) (Shmuel): There are three or four applications.
(i) Version #2 - Chachamim of Pumbadisa - (Rav): There are three or four applications;
(j) (Shmuel): There are four or five applications. (End of Version #2)
(k) They do not argue - one of them does not count the final application of water (but he admits that it must be done), the other counts it.
(l) (Version A (Rashi's Rebbi'im): According to Chachamim of Pumbadisa, Rav and Shmuel do not argue with each other - Rav does not count the final application of water (but he admits that it must be done), Shmuel counts it.
1. According to Chachamim of Sura, Rav and Shmuel both count the final application of water, they argue with each other - Rav requires ashes (1) and water (2) when it is wet; when it is dry, he adds another application of water at the beginning. Shmuel agrees when it is dry, but if it was wet, he requires ashes (1), water (2), ashes (3), water (4). (See table on this Daf.)
(m) Version B (Rashi's father): The Chachamim of Sura and Pumbadisa do not argue with each other - the former do not count the final application of water, the latter do.
(n) Version C (Tosfos): Chachamim of Sura and Pumbadisa argue with each other, but each of them holds that Rav and Shmuel do not argue with each other - Rav does not count the final application of water, Shmuel counts it.)
2) "TAHARAH" AND "HECHSHER" OF VESSELS USED WITH WINE OR OIL
(a) Question: What is the law of Akalim (a net of poles tied around grapes or olives being pressed) of Nochrim?
(b) Answer (R. Avahu - Beraisa): To Metaher a Gas or olivepress (used with Tamei wine or oil), one must rinse the boards, brooms and tub (used to press, gather and hold the grapes or olives);
1. Akalim of shoots and of Kanvus (hemp) must be dried;
2. If it is of rush (marsh reeds), one must wait 12 months before using them.
3. R. Shimon ben Gamliel says, one must wait until the next season of pressing grapes or olives.
4. (Rambam - additionally, all these vessels must be immersed; Me'iri - vessels of wood (or other vegetation) without an interior cannot become Tamei, it suffices to purge the Tamei liquids absorbed in them).
5. Question: What is the difference between the first Tana and R. Shimon ben Gamliel? (There is one pressing season per year, after the harvest.)
6. Answer: There can be more (or less) than 12 months if the grapes or olives are late (or early) to ripen.
7. R. Yosi says, one may Metaher them immediately by Hag'alah (putting them in boiling water), or scalding (pouring over them) using water in which olives were cooked).
8. R. Shimon ben Gamliel says (in R. Yosi's name) that one may put them under a flow of water from a pipe or in a spring for an Onah (a period of time, it will be explained).
9. Just as we Kasher from Yayin Nesech, we Metaher.
10. Objection: This Beraisa taught how to Metaher, not how to Kasher!
11. Correction: Rather, just as we Metaher, we Kasher from Yayin Nesech.
(c) Question: What is an Onah?
(d) Answer #1 (R. Chiya bar Aba citing R. Yochanan): A day (morning until evening) or a night.
(e) Answer #2 (R. Chana Sheina citing R. Yochanan): Twelve hours.
(f) (R. Shmuel bar Yitzchak): All agree, it is always 12 hours - R. Chiya bar Aba refers to Nisan or Tishrei, when the day and night are each 12 hours.
(g) (Rav Yehudah): Strainers of Nochrim:
1. If they are made of hair, it suffices to rinse them;
2. If they are made of wool, it suffices to dry them;
3. If they are made of linen, one must leave them for 12 months before using them;
i. If they have knots, one must untie them (before drying them - Rashi; Ramban - or before leaving them for 12 months).
(h) Baskets for straining wine:
1. If they are made of ropes of date shoots, it suffices to rinse them;
2. If they are made of reeds, it suffices to dry them;
75b---------------------------------------75b

3. If they are made of linen, one must leave them for 12 months;
i. If they have knots, one must untie them.
(i) (Rebbi or R. Chiya): If an ignoramus (who is Muchzak to be Tamei) touched grape clusters (resting in wine in a Gas), they and the surrounding clusters are Teme'im, the rest of the Gas is Tahor;
(j) (The other of Rebbi and R. Chiya): The entire Gas is Tamei.
(k) Question: According to the first opinion, why is this different than a Sheretz found in a grinder?
1. (Mishnah): If a Sheretz was found in an olive-grinder, only what it touched is Tamei;
2. If oil was flowing around the olives, everything (touching the oil) is Tamei.
(l) Answer: There, the Sheretz touched olives in the oil; here, the ignoramus touched the branches, they themselves do not touch the wine (rather, the grapes do).
(m) Rabanan told R. Yirmeyah to conduct according to the first opinion.
3) "KASHERING" VESSELS OF NOCHRIM
(a) (Mishnah): If one buys from a Nochri a utensil used for food:
1. If it does not need to be Kashered, it suffices to immerse it;
2. If boiling liquids are cooked in it, it is Kashered through Hag'alah;
3. If it is used to cook over a fire without liquid, Libun is needed (he makes it glowing hot);
i. A roasting spit or grill is Kashered through Libun.
4. A knife is Kashered by rubbing it on a sharpening stone.
(b) (Gemara - Beraisa): All of these must be immersed in a Mikveh of 40 Sa'im (Ramban - after it is Kashered; Tosfos - before or after Kashering).
(c) Question: What is the source of this?
(d) Answer (Rava): "Kol Davar Asher Yavo ba'Esh Ta'aviru ba'Esh *v'Taher*" - the Torah requires an additional Taharah after Kashering.
(e) Question (Bar Kapara): Since it says "B'Mei Nidah Yischata" (which refers to sprinkling with Mei Chatas (water on which ashes of the Parah Adumah were put)), perhaps one must sprinkle on it on the third and seventh day!
(f) Answer: "Ach" excludes this (unless the vessel is Tamei Mes).
(g) Question: If so, why does it say "B'Mei Nidah"?
(h) Answer: This teaches that he must immerse it in water that a Nidah could immerse in, i.e. a Mikveh of 40 Sa'im.
(i) The Torah must say "V'Taher", and also "B'Mei Nidah":
1. If it only said "V'Taher", one might have thought that a Mikveh of any size suffices - "B'Mei Nidah" teaches, 40 Sa'im are needed;
2. If it only said "B'Mei Nidah", one might have thought that the vessel may not be used until Ha'arev Shemesh (the night after immersion) - "V'Taher" teaches that it is permitted immediately after immersion.
(j) (Rav Nachman): Even new vessels must be immersed, for after Libun, a used vessel is like new (and the Torah requires immersion).
(k) Question (Rav Sheshes): If so, even scissors used for cutting wool should require immersion!
(l) Answer (Rav Nachman): The Parshah only discusses vessels (similar to those used with fire, i.e. vessels) used for food.
(m) (Rav Nachman): The obligation to immerse is only when one buys from a Nochri, similar to the spoils of Midyan (which were taken to keep), not if one borrows a vessel.
(n) R. Yitzchak bar Yosef thought to immerse a vessel made of dirt (that he bought from a Nochri).
(o) R. Ya'akov: The Parshah only discusses metal vessels (nothing else need be immersed).
(p) (Rav Ashi): Since glass vessels can be (melted and) made again if they break, they resemble metal vessels, they require immersion.
(q) (Rav Acha or Ravina): The law of an earthenware vessel plated with lead is like the law of the original vessel (earthenware, it need not be immersed);
(r) (The other of Rav Acha and Ravina): It has the law of the plating (metal, it must be immersed).
1. The Halachah is, it has the law of the plating.
(s) Question: If a Nochri gave a vessel as a security for a loan, is this considered like a sale?
1. Mar bar Rav Ashi: My father received a silver cup as a security, and he immersed it;
2. I do not know whether he holds that giving a security is (always) like a sale, or if he immersed it because he sensed that the Nochri would never pay, rather, he would let him keep it.
4) THE METHOD OF "KASHERING"
(a) (Beraisa): If a Yisrael buys a new vessel from a Nochri, it suffices to immerse it;
(b) If he buys a used vessel:
1. If it was used with cold food, such as cups and flasks, he rinses and immerses it;
2. If it was used with hot liquids, such as pots and kettles, he does Hag'alah and immerses it;
3. If it is used to cook over a fire without liquid, such as spits and grills, he does Libun and immerses it.
(c) (Beraisa #1): If he used it before immersing (Ramban; Tosfos - before rinsing), Hag'alah or Libun, the food it forbidden;
(d) Contradiction (Beraisa #2): The food is permitted.
(e) Resolution: The first Tana holds that Nosen Ta'am li'Fgam is forbidden (we assume that it is not a Ben Yomo, i.e. the Nochri did not cook in it in the last day, any absorbed taste is detrimental), the second Tana holds that it is permitted.
(f) Question: According to the opinion that Nosen Ta'am li'Fgam is permitted, why did the Torah require Kashering the vessels taken from Midyan?
(g) Answer (Rav Chiya bar Rav Huna): The Torah only requires Kashering a Ben Yomo, it is Nosen Ta'am li'Shvach.
(h) Question: Vessels of Nochrim should not need to be Kashered if they will not be used the same day!
(i) Answer: Chachamim decreed to Kasher them, lest they will be used the same day.
1. The opinion that Nosen Ta'am li'Fgam is forbidden holds that even absorptions in a Ben Yomo are slightly Pagum (therefore, we do not distinguish; all absorptions are forbidden, even after a day when they are very Pagum).
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