Finding Your Zivug (Mate)
Loshon Hora & Information-Seeking in Shidduchim

HOMEPAGE
ABOUT RABBI FORSYTHE
COPYRIGHT AND COPY PERMISSION LIMITATION
ASK RABBI FORSYTHE YOUR QUESTION
SHALOM BAYIS
"SHALOM BAYIS" MAGAZINE
FINDING YOUR ZIVUG
"FINDING YOUR ZIVUG" MAGAZINE
FAMILY, PARENT
& CHILD
PERSONAL GROWTH & SELF-PERFECTION
DANGERS OF LOUD AMPLIFICA-
TION AT SIMCHAS
INTERPERSONAL RELATING & MITZVOS
"IMPROVE YOUR LIFE" MAGAZINE
TORAH & PSYCHOLOGY
HASHKOFA:
VIEWS & VALUES
A TORAH INSIGHT INTO THE HOLOCAUST
HANDLING ANGER AND QUARRELS
RABBI FORSYTHE'S TAPE CATALOG
CONTACT RABBI FORSYTHE

 

 

TITLES AT A GLANCE

 

A BRIEF GENERAL REVIEW OF THAT KILLER OF RELATIONSHIPS AND SHIDDUCHIM: LASHON HORA

CENTRAL LAWS OF LASHON HORA AS SPECIFICALLY RELATED TO SHIDDUCHIM

GENERAL HALACHOS (LAWS) OF SHIDDUCHIM

WHEN MUST A STRANGER TO THE SHIDDUCH WITHHOLD OR ACTIVELY OFFER INFORMATION ABOUT THE SHIDDUCH?

HALACHOS OF ASKING AND GIVING INFORMATION ABOUT A SHIDDUCH

OBTAINING PRACTICAL INFORMATION

REPRESENTATIVE LAWS OF RICHILUSS [TALEBEARING] IN SHIDUCHIM

INVESTIGATING WHETHER YOU ARE DATING A DYSFUNCTIONAL OR MARRIAGEABLE PERSON -
PART ONE


INVESTIGATING WHETHER YOU ARE DATING A DYSFUNCTIONAL OR MARRIAGEABLE PERSON -
PART TWO


INVESTIGATING WHETHER YOU ARE DATING A DYSFUNCTIONAL OR MARRIAGEABLE PERSON -
PART THREE

------------------------

A BRIEF GENERAL REVIEW OF THAT KILLER OF RELATIONSHIPS AND SHIDDUCHIM: LASHON HORA [compiled from the Chafetz Chaim, the Vilna Gaon and Rav Avraham Asher Zimmerman, z'l]

Lashon Hora (evil speech) is negative speech which can degrade, shame or harm a Jew in any way. The Torah strictly prohibits speaking lashon hora, or accepting lashon hora that you may hear from another person. If the speech is untrue, the sin is called "motzie shaim ra (causing a bad reputation)." If a thing is spoken to the victim that the speech was against, the prohibition is called "rechilus (tale bearing)." The prohibition is not limited to evil speech. It includes all negative communications including hints, gestures, faces, statements which can be interpreted either favorably or negatively, statements which cause a response in another which is lashon hora, saying something acceptable to one's enemy or praising someone too much so the listener will say, "He is not so good," saying a valid thing that is motivated by hate or which could have any negative consequence that is not halachically justifiable, saying a thing that will make the listener think (or say or do) badly against the victim and answering the question "Who did this bad thing?"

The evil of lashon hora is equal to the evil of all other sins put together. The matters of earthly life are fleeting and not worth sinning over or being punished for. A person's first occupation in life is training himself to be silent when necessary. A person must pay close and constant attention to his behavior, especially to what comes out of his mouth and moreso when it is bain odom lechavairo (pertaining to another person) and it could be damaging in any way, without a halachically justified "to'elless (beneficial purpose)."

In matters of shidduchim or married couples, the subject of lashon hora is a very serious one. Lives can be ruined. Relationships that should exist might be destroyed and destructive relationships might be brought into unjustifiable existence. Children may be crushed. Generations who should be born may not be. Don't act on your own. Take practical questions to a qualified rov. Halachos differ for one asking questions and for one replying.

Regarding shidduchim there are times when you may not speak against and when you must speak against the prospect. When you must say bad, you may not exaggerate, must intend only beneficial outcome and only say things that are halachically considered to be proven to be true. Examples of cases in which you might speak against a shidduch (when a rov determines such) are: if the person is an apikorus [apostate] against one or more parts of the Torah, disobeyed a bais din, has a mental or physical illness or limitation (e.g. psychiatric disorder, cannot have children, heart trouble or cancer) that is covered (i.e. internal, not obvious for people themselves to see), is a thief or criminal, is deceiving the other side in the shidduch in any way (about the dowry, him/herself, etc), is destructive or dangerous, or would hate you for your knowing of a flaw that (s)he would never want to live with. One may not speak against the person's family in a way that has no bearing on the person himself (remember, we only have a Jewish people because Eliezer didn't hold Rivka's contemptible family against her!). You may also have cause to speak out against deception, exaggeration, half-truth, etc. committed by a shadchan.

When a couple is already engaged or married, the laws of evil speech are much more severe. We do not take lightly ever breaking up couples, without an extremely major and halachically proven cause. We want the opposite: to endear couples, bring them as close to each other as possible and to give them as much peace and happiness as possible. When the angels asked Avraham, "Where is Sara, your wife?" they knew that she was in her tent. They only asked Avraham to remind him of how modest and fine she was, to make him more fond of her.

The Torah tells us that a metzora (leper) suffers a spiritual disease of which the physical disease is only an external symptom or manifestation. The cause is evil speech, spoken in a spirit of arrogance or self-aggrandizement. The metzora is put out of the camp. This teaches that the way he tried to ostracize the victim against whom he spoke, he is punished with ostracism. He has to humble himself and train himself to refrain from evil speech and from hurting people. When he is healed, he brings two birds as a sacrifice. Just as birds chirp, he chirped too much. One bird is killed, to show that his mouth could kill. The other bird is taken to be set free in the "sadeh (field)." Why does the Torah specify in a field? Rabbi Avraham Asher Zimmerman, one of the previous generation's greatest Torah authorities and one of my primary Torah teachers, explained why the Torah said that the second bird should be let free specifically in the field. A midbar (desert) has no life - nothing grows. A field has cheeyuss (life) - trees, fruit, grass, vegetation - living things grow there. I may think that the sin of evil speech is so serious that I should never speak, to save myself from the chance of sin. The Torah is saying essentially, "No, you must speak." But what must one speak? The Jew uses his power of speech for things of "life" - Torah, kindness, davening and mitzvos.

 

CENTRAL LAWS OF LASHON HORA AS SPECIFICALLY RELATED TO SHIDDUCHIM

Laws relating to prohibited speech about a shidduch are complicated and, therefore, typically require your having access to a rov. On one hand, speech which can be damaging or defaming is generally not allowed, but when there is beneficial purpose (as defined by Torah law) it may be mandatory. The Torah has many prohibitions which can be violated if one withholds information, if the withholding of it can lead to a person being harmed; including Lifnay Eever (don't cause anyone to stumble in any matter), Lo S'amod Al Dom Rayecho (Do not stand idly while another is subject to danger or loss), Midvar Sheker Tirchak (Distance yourself from every false word), Mibsarcho Al Tisalaim (Do not hide from your brethren). A shadchan may only promote a shidduch that is suitable for the couple. If (s)he promotes a match for any other reason (money, reputation, drive to get couples married, etc.), (s)he violates the Torah prohibitions of Lifnay Eever and Midvar Sheker. The ONLY criteria to be used for judging suitability are: what is good or bad, compatible or not - for the boy and girl - not what the shadchan, parents or society think or want.

When asking information, you must only intend beneficial purpose in everything you ask, must only ask what is specifically relevant to the shidduch, to people who can genuinely contribute useful information, from people who know first-hand information (not hearsay). You may ask as many people as many questions as necessary in order to decide that the shidduch is satisfactory. To minimize lashon hora being repeated, do not ask through an intermediary unless that person is able to do a better job of getting information (e.g. he is better at asking or deciphering, knows the person being asked better, knows the subject matter to be discussed more expertly).

You must accept information as favorably as possible with benefit of doubt. Don't tell people about the negative information except those halachically deemed necessary. To others, just say something like, "This couple is not for each other." When you are told negative information about a Jew, you must not believe it. The principle that applies is "kabdayhu vichashdayhu [honor him while you suspect him]." When there is objective cause to be suspicious, you may act to guard against harm while remaining fully courteous and respectful to the person suspected. For example, you have scheduled a meeting with a supposedly wonderful fellow who you are going to interview as a shidduch for your daughter. After making the appointment, you hear that he might be a thief. You let him in your home to talk [don't cancel the interview], and offer him some tea [as you would any guest] but you can make sure that there are always some people in the room while he is present.

Ask general questions whenever possible so as to promote useful answers and not to promote lashon hora in the answer, for example, "What level is [his learning/her tzneeyuss] on?" rather than "Can he learn Tosfos?" or "How far down do her dresses go?" Similarly, ask general questions when asking about health or personal shortcomings, e.g. "Tell me about the person's [mental or physical health, spiritual characteristics, temperament, personality traits]." You may ask if a girl is "suitable for a Kohain." Of course, if you know or suspect particular health or hereditary conditions, spiritual or character deficiencies, or halachically significant issues about background, you may ask necessary specific questions which have a definite and constructive basis.

Answers should be specific, precise and truthful; not generalizations, exaggerations nor value judgements. "He learns five hours of gemora with Tosfos a day [not: He learns great]." "She does old Mrs. Ploney's shopping for two hours every Thursday [not: she does lots of chesed]." When saying major negatives, say as many as needed for the proper affect on shidduch, but not more. If you say the person is violent, you probably do not need to add that he gambles. Minor negatives should also be disclosed but need not be until the couple has met and decided whether there is interest, IF THE MAJOR THINGS ARE NOT NEGATIVE. This way, the negatives need only be spoken about when there is a genuine case for speaking. The non-major negatives must be revealed before either one becomes serious or emotionally involved; or if there is reason to believe, even early on, that the negative can mean there would be no shidduch.

Revelation of a flaw in a shidduch can be a big mitzva under certain circumstances, especially when it is something that is not obvious or when there is deceit by the shadchan or family. A relative or close friend can speak about major or minor flaws, even without being asked. A stranger can speak about major flaws, even without being asked. You might be able to tell people that such-and-such a shadchan lied. BUT YOU MUST KNOW WHEN YOU CAN SAY ANY NEGATIVE THING AND MUST KNOW HOW TO MEASURE EVERY WORD - SO ASK A ROV.

 

GENERAL HALACHOS (LAWS) OF SHIDDUCHIM

In Evven Ha'Ezzer (the marriage section of the Shulchan Aruch), the first subject is the laws of "be fruitful and multiply (Genesis 1:28)." It includes qualifications for a mate; including: people dedicated to Torah and kindness; healthy; and free from evil traits such as impudence, fighting and cruelty.

If a man never yet had children, he must seek a "bas bonim" (wife, who in the natural order of the world, would be expected to be capable of having a family) with whom he can fulfill the mitzva to have children, which is a man's first obligation in getting married. A woman who is at or near the end of child bearing years, or who for any reason cannot or would refuse to have children, may only marry a man who has already fulfilled his mitzva-obligation to have children or who cannot have children.

The Torah prohibits, and requires distance from, sheker (falsity, lying). This applies, of course, in all aspects of shiduchim. Therefore, you SHOULD NEVER LIE ABOUT AGE. Rabbi Shlomo Zalman Auerbach says that you cannot lie even the slightest bit. You should certainly never lie or exaggerate about ANY FACTOR that the person would be makpid (strict, particular, angered) about, would hate or resent you over, might break an engagement or marriage over. Without trust, there is no communication or lasting marriage. If you ever catch a shadchan in a lie, you may be allowed to warn others not to deal with that shadchan (check with a rov or the Chafetz Chayim's sefer on lashon hora for guidelines on when and how to tell, for the sake of protecting others). However, lying for peace in an already existing relationship might be allowed.

If a person has done tshuva, the past should not be held against the person. The Torah's story of Rivka shows how we do not hold a bad family against someone who abandons the past and embraces Torah faithfully. If a woman is not a virgin but did tshuva, she does not have to tell this on a first date but she must tell before the man becomes emotionally involved. If he accepts her, her kesuba will be that of a virgin. If a baal tshuva's unreligious mother was previously married and divorced before a second marriage from which this boy or girl was born, you must investigate whether there was (in the mother's first marriage) a kidushin (Torah marriage) and/or get (Torah divorce). A momzer (child of a prohibited relationship) and his/her descendants, till the end of time, can not marry a kosher Jew. A kosher Jew marries a kosher Jew, a momzer marries a momzer. A suffek momzer (a questionable or unverified momzer) is a more stringent case than a confirmed momzer. The Shulchan Aruch poskins that a suffek momzer cannot marry anybody - neither a kosher Jew nor a momzer (perhaps the suffek momzer is the opposite). When any boy or girl in a shidduch comes from a previously married or divorced mother, when there is any question of validity or acceptability of the get or bais din which produced it, a thorough investigation under the direction of a qualified and G-d fearing rov, is mandatory. When there is any reason to fear even a possibility of mozeruss, we must investigate. When there is no reason to fear momzeruss, a Jew has a "Chezkas Kashrus (presumption of being fine)." When a previously married woman is herself a shidduch, I tell men who are seriously interested, to require her permission to take her get to their rov so he can poskin that the get is blemishless and that she is truly available, before they can become involved.

There are various opinions about age difference. The Shulchan Aruch (Evven HaEzzer) itself only prohibits an early teenage girl from marrying an elderly man because the very young person may not remain faithful. The Steipler said that a teenage girl should stay within ten years. We can infer that once she leaves teenage, we can stretch the age difference so that she can marry a man considerably older, judging the coupling by how well the two would get along and suit each other. A woman can be a bit older than the man if they are suitable and she still can supply him with needed child-bearing years.

The main concern in any shidduch is that (s)he is now faithfully frum, has good midos, has a rov who the person obeys and wants a Torah home. In all cases, consult a qualified rov, even repeatedly, and ask case-by-case shaalos. Do not take on yourself to decide or to rely on subjective thinking. These are all questions of halacha, and complex halacha; and in halacha we are obligated to do "what is straight and good in the eyes of G-d (Deuteronomy 6:18)."

 

WHEN MUST A STRANGER TO THE SHIDDUCH WITHHOLD OR ACTIVELY OFFER INFORMATION ABOUT THE SHIDDUCH?

A major part of marital trouble or break-up results from untrue, vague, half-true, incomplete, ignored, evasive or undisclosed information. Those who ask or give information, even with good intentions, may be subjective in the criteria for deciding what to say or not say - even when they sincerely want to be helpful. Therefore, I am writing here some of the major halachos (laws) of disclosing and not disclosing information, in two parts to address two aspects. This material IS NOT INTENDED to enable you to poskin - IT IS INTENDED TO 1. CONVEY HOW COMPLICATED THESE HALACHOS ARE AND 2. TO ENABLE YOU TO KNOW WHEN YOU HAVE A SHAALA TO ASK A ROV. Do not take these issue upon yourself to decide. Ask a rov, EVEN IF YOU NEED TO ASK HIM 20 SHAALOS IN ANY GIVEN SHIDDUCH. There is no mitzva that comes through a sin (Gemora Suka). ONLY SHIDDUCHIM APPROACHED ACCORDING TO THE WILL OF G-D WILL HAVE THE BLESSING OF G-D.

There are three halachic categories for discussing shidduchim and each has different obligations; a person who is: 1. a "stranger" to the shidduch (i.e. not one of the people asking or being asked information), 2. asking and 3. being asked. In this installment, we will discuss the first category.

A stranger to the shidduch (one not asking or asked information; e.g. a schoolmate, neighbor, etc.) may know some information about the boy and/or girl. This person may not offer information if not asked, unless the matter is of utmost seriousness (e.g. major illness or defect, violent or promiscuous tendency, unfaithful to some part of Torah observance, inability to have children, psychological illness, an illness that occurred three or more times in the family [the Steipler says "three times" can mean either in one generation or in more than one generation], anything that will cause major loss or damage, anything that can potentially break up an engagement or marriage if learned about later, anything that most people, or this individual, would be "makpid [stringent, particular]" about, bad midos [flawed character traits] or any intentional attempt by one of the parties to trick/deceive the other).

The stranger is obligated to offer serious information and is obligated to not offer unsolicited information that is less than serious. Ask a rov when and how to reveal such information because the laws are complicated. For some examples, 1. do you yourself know about the defect (e.g. are you the person's doctor to know the person has cancer, one lung, diabetes, epilepsy or heart trouble; which you must reveal) or is it only hearsay (the K'sav Sofer says that you cannot go by hearsay)? 2. should you first ask the person what (s)he knows about this matter ("has plony discussed health with you?") because plony may have already disclosed the problem and then you will have no permission to speak about it, 3. is it a revealed blemish that is in the open and can be seen itself or is it a covered/internal/non-apparent defect that a person cannot see? 4. what point is the couple at (are they already serious or engaged?), 5. the couple thinks they are for each other but you know [objectively and factually] they are not likely to succeed together, 6. is this a defect that people don't tend to expect, don't tend to investigate carefully or may have been lied to about? There can be numerous questions that can affect what to do or say, so speak to your rov comprehensively in each individual case.

It is better for revelation of a blemish/problem to come from the boy or girl him/herself, rather than from another person. Any tone of deception or evasion will kill trust and the Maharal writes that no marriage can last without unending trust. Everybody involved in the shidduch must be honest. The Chazone Ish says that you receive SIYATA DISHMAYA [Heaven's help] for obeying halacha. Ask a rov what is proper timing for when to reveal various defects and for how to handle lies by any of the information-givers or by the shadchan.

Close friends and relatives have greater responsibility. They must offer information about relatively minor blemishes, even if not asked, especially if the boy or girl would resent it if you knew about the defect and didn't tell.

If the person would resent your intrusion, you answer GENTLY that you are acting ACCORDING TO A ROV'S P'SAK IN HALACHA, not according to your own personal thinking, and that YOU ARE ONLY CONCERNED ABOUT THE BOY'S OR GIRL'S BEST LONG-RUN INTERESTS. To be continued on asking and revealing information.

 

HALACHOS OF ASKING AND GIVING INFORMATION ABOUT A SHIDDUCH

One of the crucial matters in shidduchim is the aspect of "getting references." One of the causes of marriage trouble or failure is the non-halachic seeking or giving of "information." People are afraid of speaking loshon hora (evil, slanderous speech) and do not want to destroy a coupling, since making a match is "as difficult as opening the Yam Suf [Reed Sea]." It is possible to be in serious and destructive error when you 1. do not say something that you are required to say or 2. say something that you are required to withhold. This installment is a continuation of the previous. We will here address laws of those who ask for information and those who are asked. I must stress that this is a matter of COMPLEX HALACHA (Torah law) and that YOU CANNOT TAKE UPON YOURSELF TO DECIDE WHAT TO ASK, REVEAL (WHEN ASKED), ACTIVELY OFFER (WITHOUT BEING ASKED) OR WITHHOLD. Please ask a rov shaalos to obtain clear and authoritative case by case instruction.

Whether you are the person asking for information or the person being asked for information, your intentions should be totally leshaim Shomayim (for the sake of Heaven), to help bring about a marriage that should be and to prevent any marriage that the Torah says should not be.

A person asking questions about a shidduch (the boy or girl, a relative or advisor, a rabbi or rebitzen) is allowed to ask as many questions of as many people as needed. It is meritorious to investigate carefully and to do all of the "homework" that you see fit. The more people you speak to, the more you are likely to uncover inconsistencies, fabrications and meaningful data. The Chafetz Chayim says that questions must be specific and you must reveal why you are asking (that it is for a shidduch), and the other person is not obligated to give information to you unless you make clear that there is "to'elles (beneficial, constructive purpose)" that constitutes a halachically permissible reason to speak about a person. Another way of looking at this is that questions and answers must be relevant and purposeful so that your talk will not bear any guilt of lashon hora. Pirkei Avos (chapter five) says that one who is an intelligent person will not interrupt, will only ask to-the-point questions, will only give answers after deliberation and according to halacha, will answer the first thing first and the last thing last, will say that "I do not know" about what he does not know, and he acknowledges the truth.

It is entirely alright to appoint a shliach (representative), or more than one, to ask information because this may obtain more, better or more accurate information (e.g. his Rosh Yeshiva talks to her seminary's principal, his uncle goes to shul with her father's neighbor, her school friend knows his sister).

The person receiving/replying to questions about a shidduch must realize that (s)he is playing with lives. Rabbi Chayim of Brisk said that speaking against a person of marriageable age is killing, and only the Sanhedrin (Torah Supreme Court adjacent to the Holy Temple) of 23 judges has the authority to execute. We must be very careful. There are many considerations about what to say and not say. We cannot say lashon hora but, on the other hand, "Lo samod al dam rayecha (Leviticus 19:16; we cannot stand idly by while our brother bleeds to death)," we cannot cause michshol (another to stumble into trouble or a mistake) or nezek (harm, damage).

If you do not know something, do not speak as if you know. If you know something in general, but not specific details, you can ask for time (to call a rov, or find out from a halachically reliable first-hand source - not hearsay or rumor) or say "I don't know." You may not speak for personal motives (e.g. hate, revenge, subjective opinions about who you think the boy or girl ought to marry). If you are asked a question directly, you cannot evade it nor lie.

There is greater responsibility for a close friend or relative. If you are asked by or about a close friend or relative, you can offer additional information over what was asked about, such as information about what is not suitable in the shidduch or you can offer information about minor defects.

You may discuss a person's shortcomings with people who can make a practical and beneficial difference, but Rabbi Shlomo Zalman Auerbach says that this must be done with seichel (intelligence) and only with those people who are necessary to actually help (ask a rov).

 

OBTAINING PRACTICAL INFORMATION

One of the things I constantly study when I do counseling is where the root of problems lie. One common theme that I often see is: where mistakes are made in the courting and mate-selection process. Given the diverse minhagim among Torah Jews, there are at least two categories into which this must be divided. I must differentiate Chasidish from non-Chasidish, because the latter (e.g. Litvish, Sefardic, Modern) generally go on dates while the Chasidish use the "bashow" procedure [wherein the boy and girl have in-house meetings and do not date nor meet much in person]. The approaches to dealing with mate-selection in the two groups are very different. In another section of this site, I plan to deal with the scenario of Chasidim of the "Bashow" custom. They rely heavily on investigation about the individuals and their families, instead. Now we move on to a different mate-selecting procedure, and obtaining signs in advance for a good and lasting marriage.

Singles (including divorced and widowed) who come to me for counseling are concerned about problematic dating, how to select, relating behavior, making or repeating mistakes, potential durability of a marriage, discovering a phoney, etc. I advise the non-Chasidish singles to examine the prospects with someone whom they date. When you go out, especially with a new person, find things to do that allow you to get to know each other, interact with each other, and that you both enjoy. Some examples along this line that people report to work well include bowling, miniature golf, a museum or botanical garden. Such activities are fun, they feel light and comfortable, you communicate (if you can't find what to say by yourself, you can talk about what you are seeing or doing to "break the ice"). Do not go to a movie or show or anything that precludes interacting with each other while you are doing it. It is a mathematics axiom that parallel lines never meet. If you and your date are parallel lines watching a stage or screen, you don't meet! Besides, there are serious halachic problems with the content of most movies or shows these days, so they are generally not suitable in Jewish law. Choose activities that allow you to interact. Enjoy your time together and spend a sufficient amount of time to get to know each other REASONABLY well (note: before marriage, you can't know any person PERFECTLY).

When you are getting to know each other more, after a few initial dates, I recommend that people go out for a full length day-trip (e.g. drive out-of-town to the country - making sure to keep the laws prohibiting Yichud/seclusion), perhaps more than once. By spending a prolonged period of time, people tend to become more and more themselves as a day stretches out. You more and more get to see the real person in greater depth. You get to see some of the foibles or inconsistencies and some of the ways the person interacts with relating partners or challenging life situations. As you get further into your day, more of the real person comes out. There's only so much that a person can act. Over time, the guard goes down more and more. You may, for example, see if the person is ever rude, critical, mean, inconsiderate, impatient, selfish, dishonest or condescending. Even if the person is nice to you, is the person nasty to a waiter or gas station attendant? Does the person get angry or vulgar in a traffic jam? You can better judge - and have more insight into - whether this is someone you can really relate to, trust and appreciate; whether the person's good qualities are sincere, stable and authentic. There is no guarantee that a person won't maintain an act. I've seen some really shrewd, troubled, insecure, manipulative people who consciously hide their faults well until a relationship is quite developed and another person is emotionally "hooked" or until after marriage. However, there can often be signs, if you know how to read them. For example, Chazal say that you can tell who a person is by who he praises. Does the person praise Pirkei Avos or Dow Jones, the Chofetz Chayim or the Super Bowl?

IN DIRECT PROPORTION TO ANY CONCERN OR SUSPICION, 1. call more people for information than you would otherwise (the more concern, the more people), and 2. see more of the people you contact for information "in person" face-to-face (the more concern, the more people you must speak to in-person...to get facial gestures or visual signs that may indicate invented, covered or incomplete information, or evasiveness; which would be hidden over the phone). In my counseling experience, some marriage trouble and break-up stems from untrue, rushed, undisclosed, vague, half-true or ignored information; so if something seems odd, inconsistent or worrisome; believe nothing more than the name and address of the boy or girl! EVERYTHING THAT YOU COULDN'T GET FROM ANY PHONE BOOK, CHECK OUT YOURSELF THOROUGHLY! Call a rov for what to discuss.

Do not merely infer something about a shidduch that needs to be actually verified and known. The gemora says that when witnesses came, if they said, "We did not see a moon," Sanhedrin CANNOT declare the day to NOT be Rosh Chodesh because WHAT YOU DO NOT SEE IS NOT TESTIMONY. If witnesses see the moon, bais din can declare the day to be Rosh Chodesh. ONLY WHAT YOU SEE IS TESTIMONY. THE SAME APPLIES IN SHIDDUCHIM. And, the same way you check out the boy/girl, check out the shadchan! Get references to couples and parents and inquire from them whether the shadchan's work and attitude were satisfactory, honest and helpful.

Is there instability, dishonesty or dysfunction in the family? Don't be fooled by those who act saintly in public and are beasts in their home. Even if the home has problems, HAS THE INDIVIDUAL BOY OR GIRL RISEN ABOVE ANY SHORTCOMINGS OF THE FAMILY (remember, we have our Jewish people specifically BECAUSE RIVKA LEFT EVIL BESUEL AND LOVON!). Does the boy or girl have good midos, straight hashkofos and loyalty to Torah? Is the boy or girl tocho kibaro (the same person inside and out), eidl (gentle) and temimi (uncomplicated, psychologically and religiously)? Is the person sensitive, considerate and responsive to other people? How does the person handle disagreement, provocation or pressure? Does the person have a good heart and do chesed, and take responsibility for other people in somewhat mature ways? Does (s)he keep his word? Does the youth have a rov for HALACHA AND LIFE QUESTIONS - who the person FAITHFULLY LISTENS TO (not just goes to!)? Warning: some manipulative people craft shaalos to get desired answers; find out if the person's questions also are honest! Does the boy or girl have good social skills, regular and healthy group interactions, and fine bain adam lechavairo (interpersonal) conduct? If you have any doubts, the inquiring set of parents and/or their child should spend more time with the prospect to see if any flaws, inconsistencies, "bad vibes" or arguing come to the surface.

Have at least one, preferably several, QUALIFIED and caring advisors (rebitzen, rabbi, counselor) who know you reasonably well. One may catch something another missed, or have input the other did not have. Get OBJECTIVE input. Talk over impressions, events, reactions, behaviors (of the person you are dating and your own) and whether your various feelings are helpful and reliable or not. Don't be too hasty to either accept or reject a prospect for marriage. You don't want to get hurt for marrying or dumping someone you should not have. You must have BALANCE (as with all things in the Torah).

In any of these cases (Chasidish or not), all we can really do is increase chances for the good, not guarantee. The point for everybody is: 1. well-done Hishtadlus (practical effort); 2. each single truly being the best and most marriageable person (s)he can be; 3. and prayer to Hashem for mercy, help, success and blessing.

 

REPRESENTATIVE LAWS OF RICHILUSS [TALEBEARING] IN SHIDDUCHIM

To treat our discussion of loshon hora in shidduchim responsibly, must address an entire segment of halacha which stems from a prohibitive Torah mitzva: Richiluss [not to be a tale bearer to the detriment of another]. Since practical cases can be complex and serious, ALWAYS TAKE A QUESTION TO A ROV BEFORE YOU ACT. This material is primarily based on the Chofetz Chayim on Richiluss.

In many cases in which one will want to tell someone something negative about a potential partner, whether for business or marriage, five pre-conditions generally have to apply. The telling has to be for the purpose of saving someone from bad (e.g. loss, crime or harm) or enabling him to guard himself from bad.

The five conditions are: 1. you are obligated to first discern that the bad is truly bad (not your perception or opinion), 2. you must speak no exaggeration, just tell precisely what is bad, 3. only intend "to'eless" (benefit) - if you can not intend in your heart a constructive purpose, you must force yourself when telling to want "to'elles," 4. there must be no other option, and 5. there must be no actual causing of bad to the person spoken about as result of talking and, if it is unavoidable to cause bad, you must cause no more bad than halacha permits [withholding a good (e.g. the shidduch) does NOT count as causing bad (e.g. suffering or damage) - withholding good is not causing bad].

In cases of protecting someone from harm, it is better if two adult males tell about the person's faults together so, if they are needed in bais din, they constitute kosher witnesses, and what they do [if according to da'as Torah] is no worse than bais din acting on their testimony. This applies whether telling on their own or when asked to speak and whether before the shidduch or after. If they fulfill all five conditions, they must speak; if not, they must not speak.

If the shidduch is an apikorus or does serious sinning or has a serious spiritual, physical, moral or psychological defect, it is a mitzva to tell.

If the shidduch has a minor defect or if one side is deceiving the other, you can tell this information if you have the five conditions. If both sides are deceiving each other, this is considered an even match (e.g. he can't learn as well as represented and her father intends to retract on financial support). Leave them alone and don't reveal anything. If only her father is deceiving, you can reveal this to the man if the shidduch depends upon support, but it is better to advise him how to get the support from the father-in-law rather than bust the shidduch. If it is before the shidduch (engagement), this is to'eless. If it is after the shidduch, and you discern that chosson will not accept your words as final (judging favorably, as required by halacha) and will only use your information as a basis to investigate, or you know he will not do anything without din (Torah law), you are permitted to tell the chosson only if with the five conditions and only if there is no deceit on side of chosson. If the choson would break the shidduch just from hearing hearsay, this violates condition five: causing more harm than allowed by din. If the other side intends actual harm, you may reveal with conditions, even after shidduch, if the only result will be that he protect himself from harm.

You may reveal illnesses which are not in the open even if you are not asked to. You must discern if it truly is a sickness. If it is the person's nature, this is not considered illness. After the shidduch, you can only tell this with the five conditions, and only if you know this yourself and not from hearsay, and 1. if you discern that family will check this out thoroughly rather than just canceling the shidduch or 2. if the person would hate you for not telling.

On rare occasions, you may speak on the basis of hearsay; but the matter must 1. be very serious, 2. have some reasonable basis and 3. be determined permissible by a rov in advance of speaking. If you ever have a case permitting hearsay, you must say "I heard" and not "I know."

If you reveal a minor defect that is possible to learn (e.g. a rabbi could have tested a chosson and you say he is not smart), this is the sin of motzee shaim ra (defamation). This is completely forbidden after a shidduch is made.

If you know of a flaw, you must evaluate if the person will NOT listen, still make the shidduch, afterwards quarrel and then say, "So-and-so was right that I shouldn't have made a shidduch with you," or will hate the partner - this is classic richiluss and you can not tell. OR if you discern that, if you tell, he will tell people you advised him not to do the shidduch for whatever reason, and this will reach the person spoken against; or if the person will ask "why have you broken the shidduch with me?" the person will say "Because so-and-so said this-and-that about you," you may not tell because this will be richillus.

If possible, avoid speech and let a situation reveal the person's flaw by itself. For example, if the person has a temper, if you do not tell but you can bring the other to place where person will show his temper and the message is accomplished, this is better than saying bad against the person. This hetter only applies in such a case where you are saving someone from a partnership that can end up damaging the other partner - and only if this causes no actual bad but just saves victim. For example, if the victim who you show the angry scene to would publicize the person's temper all over town, so he will lose his job and be disgraced out of his shul, instead of his just being blocked from causing a damaging shidduch, you may not even bring victim to see the anger, and all the moreso, you may not tell).

You cannot speak against the shidduch's family or forebears unless there is indication the shidduch will be bad because of it (e.g. the family is promiscuous and the shidduch could be too). Then you can speak without the five conditions.

 

INVESTIGATING WHETHER YOU ARE DATING A DYSFUNCTIONAL OR MARRIAGEABLE PERSON - PART ONE

One of the things I constantly study when I do counseling is where the root of problems lie. One common theme that I often see among single and "already married" people is: where mistakes are made in the courting and mate-selection process.

Singles who come to me for counseling (including divorced and widowed) are concerned about problematic dating, how to select a good match, relating behavior, making or repeating mistakes, breaking their unworkable patterns, potential durability of a marriage, discovering a phoney or a troubled person, etc.

Chasidim use the "Bashow" procedure and heavy investigation, instead of dating, about which I have written separately [see the "Bashow" subsite under "Finding Your Zivug"]. The portion of this series of articles which pertains to investigation while on dates applies to non-Chasidim who date. The other portions (e.g. about obtaining and verifying information, acquiring and evaluating evidence of dysfunction in a shidduch or his/her family, determining what is lashon hora vs. necessary to speak about, etc.) applies to those of all customs.

Every person is an individual, so I never like generalizations. From my counseling experience, it is very common for those who grow up exposed to dysfunction of any kind to be impacted by it. If the negative behavior was between the parents, the child can learn to relate to a relationship partner the way he saw his parents relate. If, as a young person, he saw dysfunction between parent and child, he can be trained that way too (learning distorted and destructive ideas and behavior about how to treat and raise one's children).

Often, the impact can be in terms of "emotional association," so the relationship between the person's history and his behavior might be less seemingly direct or obvious, and it might require professional training to recognize. However, people grow up to understand reality according to their perception of their upbringing. Some people are deep enough to see that destructive behavior is not an option and they decide that they will not treat a spouse or child abusively BUT, they might manifest this in extreme or distorted ways that can be unhealthy in some other aspect. For example, they may go to another extreme; or turn off and be emotionally unavailable to a spouse or children because of fear of failure, insecurity, defense against inner trauma or as if "doing nothing means I do nothing wrong."

For example, a grown up can be a workaholic so he provides generously for his children - but is never there for them emotionally or is constantly not physically present when the child needs a parent there. He has not stopped his family's "tradition" of emotional starvation of its children. HE HAS ONLY SWITCHED ITS MANIFESTATION FROM EMOTIONAL ABUSE TO EMOTIONAL DEPRIVATION. HE HASN'T ESCAPED HIS HISTORY. HE HAS JUST MODIFIED ITS EXPRESSION. His children could grow up to pursue dysfunctional or futile relationships. I had a case in which a young woman sought dysfunctional men, one after the other, because she desperately needed to feel validated, since her "nice" but workaholic father was never there for her. Her father provided for her materially but she was starved for love and self-worth. All of her father's money didn't address this for her. By trying to "rescue" losers who were incapable of love or commitment, she hoped to earn or extract a man's love and recognition for her. It was unattainable and she ran from futile relationship to futile relationship. She emotionally associated dysfunctional men with her own intense and misguided quest for meaning and her intense need for emotional fulfillment and self-concept.

Often, it takes deep therapeutic counseling to heal and resolve such issues, and this only is possible in any real way when there is more motivation to change than to maintain one's habits and patterns. When this happens, it is often, unfortunately, after the person has had one or more seriously painful and disappointing relationship failures. If it is catastrophic enough, the person is forced to see that what they do and the partners they select don't work out, and they have to reconsider and explore what is going on within. This takes enormous internal strength.

I find as a counselor that people from troubled backgrounds typically bring childhood trouble with them to their being a spouse or parent. But if a person is motivated, substantial, honest and courageous enough; they can fix their issues; learn what is wrong and unhealthy; and become satisfactory as spouse and parent. But, generally it takes hard, painful and persevering work. The percentage of people who actually complete and succeed in their work in these areas is not very large, as a matter of making healthy and successful marriages and homes.

 

INVESTIGATING WHETHER YOU ARE DATING A DYSFUNCTIONAL OR MARRIAGEABLE PERSON - PART TWO

If you are dating someone about whom you (or any of your trusted advisors) have any suspicion may be dysfunctional, you have to investigate very carefully and thoroughly.

When possible, ask your rabbis, rebitzens, mature friends and married acquaintances to investigate by obtaining and contacting references. Cross-check information to detect half-truths, cover-ups, deceit and/or contradictions or other "red flag" signals to worry about and further investigate. It is legitimate to ask about a shidduch all that is reasonably needed, even if only for a vague but genuine suspicion.

Often people are attracted to dysfunctional relationships as if people have antennas for relating partners who feed into their issues, often with some kind of irrational and rigid co-dependence and unjustifiable defense of the relationship or partner.

When one stumbles into a relationship with someone dysfunctional, it is great to get out before marriage - but it is better not to get in with someone dysfunctional, in the first place.

I do not believe that everyone is automatically entitled to marry. They must be basically free from being harmful, irresponsible, immature, spoiled, selfish, rigid and other destructive or unfair characteristics; as each has no right to hurt or shortchange another. If one isn't ready for the obligations, responsibilities and duties of marriage; one should not be allowed to marry. Unfortunately, it is a status symbol and marriage does not always represent itself in its own right. People want the status, non-loneliness, someone to control or possess, social acceptance or other irrelevant or neurotic things. As marriage partners, they are deadbeats. Halacha prohibits - and makes everyone accountable for - harmful activity.

If one finds him/herself attracted to dysfunctional people repeatedly, the person needs professional attention. If one is duped once, the person needs better investigative skills and techniques; and perhaps the help of others who can do some diligent investigation; to look for verification of, or contradictions within, the information.

One must also have a balanced view: there are no perfect shidduchim so each must evaluate what (s)he can live with, who (s)he might be able to be supportive and accepting of and compatible with, and what another person's good points are. Some people have strengths or patience that enable them to widen the range of people they could manage with [as long as the other person is never damaging or neglectful]. Some people come out of dysfunctional homes alright and some people come out of functional homes "relationship disasters." Some people are impacted intensely and others are impacted only slightly. You have to take people one by one.

IN DIRECT PROPORTION TO ANY CONCERN OR SUSPICION, 1. call more people for information than you would otherwise (the more concern, the more people), and 2. see more of the people you contact for information "in person" face-to-face (the more concern, the more people you must speak to in-person...to get facial gestures or visual signs that may indicate invented, covered or incomplete information, or evasiveness; which would be hidden over the phone). In my counseling experience, some marriage trouble and break-up stems from untrue, rushed, undisclosed, vague, half-true or ignored information; so if something seems odd, inconsistent or worrisome; believe nothing more than the name and address of the boy or girl! EVERYTHING THAT YOU COULDN'T GET FROM ANY PHONE BOOK, CHECK OUT YOURSELF THOROUGHLY!

Call a rov for what to discuss and to determine what is lashon hora vs. what is necessary to speak about in each case.

Do not merely infer something about a shidduch that needs to be actually verified and known. The gemora says that when witnesses came, if they said, "We did not see a moon," Sanhedrin CANNOT declare the day to NOT be Rosh Chodesh because WHAT YOU DO NOT SEE IS NOT TESTIMONY. If witnesses see the moon, bais din can declare the day to be Rosh Chodesh. ONLY WHAT YOU SEE IS TESTIMONY. THIS APPLIES IN ALL AREAS INCLUDING SHIDDUCHIM. And, the same way you check out the boy/girl, check out the shadchan! Get references to couples and parents and inquire from them whether the shadchan's work and attitude were satisfactory, honest and helpful.

Is there instability, dishonesty or dysfunction in the family? Don't be fooled by those who act saintly in public and are beasts in their home. Even if the home has problems, HAS THE INDIVIDUAL BOY OR GIRL RISEN ABOVE ANY SHORTCOMINGS OF THE FAMILY (remember, we have our Jewish people specifically BECAUSE RIVKA LEFT EVIL BESUEL AND LOVON!). Does the boy or girl have good midos, straight hashkofos and loyalty to Torah? Is the boy or girl tocho kibaro (the same person inside and out), eidl (gentle) and temimi (uncomplicated, psychologically and religiously)? Is the person sensitive, considerate and responsive to other people? How does the person handle disagreement, provocation or pressure? Does the person have a good heart and do chesed, and take responsibility for other people in somewhat mature ways? Does (s)he keep his word? Does the youth have a rov for HALACHA AND LIFE QUESTIONS - who the person FAITHFULLY LISTENS TO (not just goes to!)? Warning: some manipulative people craft shaalos to get desired answers; find out if the person's questions are honest! Does the boy or girl have good social and communicating skills, regular and healthy group interactions, and fine bain adam lechavairo (interpersonal) conduct? If you have any doubts, the inquiring set of parents and/or their child should spend more time with the prospect to see if any flaws, inconsistencies, "bad vibes" or arguing come to the surface.

 

INVESTIGATING WHETHER YOU ARE DATING A DYSFUNCTIONAL OR MARRIAGEABLE PERSON - PART THREE

I advise singles who date to examine the prospects with someone whom they date. When you go out, especially with a new person, find things to do that allow you to get to know each other, interact with each other, and that you both enjoy. Some examples, along this line, that people report to work well include bowling, miniature golf, a museum or botanical garden. Such activities are fun, they feel light and comfortable, you communicate (if you can't find what to say by yourself, you can talk about what you are seeing or doing to "break the ice"). Do not go to a movie, a show or anything that precludes interacting with each other while you are doing it. It is a mathematics axiom that parallel lines never meet. If you and your date are parallel lines watching a stage or screen, you don't meet! Besides, there are serious halachic problems with the content of most movies or shows these days, so they are generally not suitable in Jewish law. Choose activities that allow you to interact. Enjoy your time together and spend a sufficient amount of time to get to know each other REASONABLY well (note: before marriage, you can't know any person PERFECTLY).

When couples are getting to know each other more, after a few initial dates, I recommend that they go out for a full length day-trip (e.g. drive out-of-town to the country - making sure to keep the laws prohibiting Yichud/seclusion), perhaps doing this more than once. By spending a prolonged period of time, people tend to become more and more themselves as a day stretches out. You more and more get to see the real person in greater depth. You get to see some of the foibles or inconsistencies and some of the ways the person interacts with relating partners or challenging life situations. As you get further into your day, more of the real person comes out. There is only so much that a person can act. Over time, the guard goes down more and more. You may, for example, see if the person is ever critical, mean, inconsiderate, impatient, selfish or dishonest. Even if the person is nice to you, is the person's conduct rude or condescending to a waiter or gas station attendant? Does the person get angry, nasty or vulgar in a traffic jam? Does the person speak loshon hora [slander]? You can better judge - and have more insight into - whether this is someone you can really relate to, trust and appreciate; whether the person's good qualities are sincere, stable, consistent and authentic. There is no guarantee that a person won't maintain an act. I've seen some really shrewd, troubled, insecure, manipulative people who consciously hide their faults well until a relationship is quite developed and another person is emotionally "hooked" or until after marriage. However, there can often be signs, if you know how to read them. For example, Chazal say that you can tell who a person is by who he praises. Does the person praise Pirkei Avos or Dow Jones, the Chofetz Chayim or the Super Bowl, doing chesed or a shopping spree?

I am not suggesting that you ever "trap" a person. I am just saying to enter into situations in which the person is more likely to be his/her honest self, and behave his/her own way. Observe and learn from "real life situations" about how the person handles provocation and whether the person has any temper or character weakness. Do not intentionally provoke the person yourself. That would be a sin and no shidduch can be blessed if it comes about through any sin, whether deceiving, instigating or any other sort.

If a person has very good midos, a strong striving for truth and to generally behave as a "mentsh" [decent, mature, honorable human being], has considerable and authentic will to work on him/herself and the ability to do tshuva [lasting and reliable repentance] for wrong conduct; and if the person can relate and communicate in a genuine "two-way-street" fashion; the person who had a rough history might be able to fulfill the role of spouse and parent satisfactorily. Do not make a decision about such a person or relationship alone nor hastily. Investigate thoroughly so you "go in with your eyes open," and obtain da'as Torah and the advice of wise, mature, objective and concerned people. The more that you have suspicion, the more you should obtain information and verification of that information.

Have at least one, preferably several, QUALIFIED and caring advisors (e.g. rebitzen, rabbi, counselor) who know you reasonably well. One may catch something another missed, or have input the other did not have. Get OBJECTIVE input. Talk over impressions, events, reactions, behaviors (of the person you are dating and your own) and whether your various feelings are helpful and reliable or not. Don't be too hasty to either accept or reject a prospect for marriage. You don't want to get hurt, whether for marrying OR dumping someone you should not have. You must have BALANCE (as with all things in the Torah).

In any of these cases, all we can really do is increase chances for the good, not guarantee anything. The point for everybody is: 1. well-done Hishtadlus (practical effort); 2. each single truly being the best and most marriageable person (s)he can be; 3. and prayer to Hashem for mercy, help, success and blessing.